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Post by clipanswerman on Jan 24, 2024 16:00:08 GMT -8
There may be some recency bias here, but this is how I see it.
6. Shamet for Luke Kennard
5. Chris Paul for Lou Williams and Montrezl Harrell
4. Bledsoe and Justice for Norman Powell
3. Muscala for Zubac
2. Gordon, Kaman, Aminu for Chris Paul
1. Covington, Morris and Batum for Harden
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Post by babyradar01 on Jan 24, 2024 17:59:23 GMT -8
Sam Cassell...Maggette...Brand...Hollywood Harper?? You left off too many good ones
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Post by gilp5 on Jan 24, 2024 18:26:46 GMT -8
There may be some recency bias here, but this is how I see it. 6. Shamet for Luke Kennard 5. Chris Paul for Lou Williams and Montrezl Harrell 4. Bledsoe and Justice for Norman Powell 3. Muscala for Zubac 2. Gordon, Kaman, Aminu for Chris Paul 1. Covington, Morris and Batum for Harden CAM would you give PG a 50m/year extension, similar to Kawhi? You never answered this. |
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Post by tullabye on Jan 24, 2024 19:05:32 GMT -8
We received Elton Brand for Skinner and Tyson Chandler
Muscala and Beasley for Zu
Bridges for SGA
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Post by clipanswerman on Jan 25, 2024 11:43:41 GMT -8
Sam Cassell...Maggette...Brand...Hollywood Harper?? You left off too many good ones Right after I posted, I actually said 'wait you forgot the Brand group - and Brand, Cassell and Magette came into my mind (Harper didn't) So here's my revised list: 1. Covington, Batum, Morris for Harden 2. Gordon, Kaman and Aminu for Chris Paul 3. Second pick for Elton Brand 4. Muscala for Zubac 5. Maggette (and Dooling) for a future first in 2006 which became the 22nd pick which became a nobody although Kyle Lowry was drafted two picks later 6. Bledsoe and Justice Winslow for Norman Powell 7. Marko Jaric for Sam Cassell 8. Chris Paul for Lou Williams and Montrezl Harrell 9. Shamet for Luke Kennard |
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Post by clipanswerman on Jan 25, 2024 11:44:11 GMT -8
There may be some recency bias here, but this is how I see it. 6. Shamet for Luke Kennard 5. Chris Paul for Lou Williams and Montrezl Harrell 4. Bledsoe and Justice for Norman Powell 3. Muscala for Zubac 2. Gordon, Kaman, Aminu for Chris Paul 1. Covington, Morris and Batum for Harden CAM would you give PG a 50m/year extension, similar to Kawhi? You never answered this. |
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Post by clipanswerman on Jan 25, 2024 12:00:55 GMT -8
There may be some recency bias here, but this is how I see it. 6. Shamet for Luke Kennard 5. Chris Paul for Lou Williams and Montrezl Harrell 4. Bledsoe and Justice for Norman Powell 3. Muscala for Zubac 2. Gordon, Kaman, Aminu for Chris Paul 1. Covington, Morris and Batum for Harden CAM would you give PG a 50m/year extension, similar to Kawhi? You never answered this. First of all, Paul George has been fantastic this year. Playing off the ball, he's great. In fact, I'm changing my midseason grade for him from a B to an A-. What was fun about the last game on TNT was the play by play guy, a new guy, noting that Paul George had made some really ridiculous lazy turnovers - Jimmy Jackson who was doing the color said it was a problem with 'the Clippers' and as usual never mentioned the turnover issue ini connection with Paul George (just the Clippers as they always do on the local broadcasts) and then the announcer screamed 'ANOTHER TURNOVER BY PAUL GEORGE!!'. In the general way that you're phrasing it, the answer is 'No'. He's not Kawhi. He doesn't command a double team. He's not the offensive player that Norman Powell is for example, although they're in different leagues defensively. Assuming we were under the cap, no. I'd rather do a sign and trade and let someone else pay and get any of about 30 players for less. But we're not. The first and most important thing is - are we keeping Harden? Until we know that for sure, i.e. until Harden is signed, then I'd make a decision. Without Harden, definitely no, I'd go as high as $25m for 2-3 years without Harden With Harden, I'd go close to whatever his marekt value is - I'm guessing it will be about $35-$40m per year for three years. At that point, yes, I'd sign him. |
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Post by clipanswerman on Jan 25, 2024 12:02:15 GMT -8
We received Elton Brand for Skinner and Tyson Chandler Muscala and Beasley for Zu Bridges for SGA I don't consider trading the 11th pick for the 12th pick and then picking the guy we probably would have gotten at 11 a 'trade' but if it is considered a trade, it's probably our best one ever. |
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Post by gilp5 on Jan 25, 2024 12:21:44 GMT -8
CAM would you give PG a 50m/year extension, similar to Kawhi? You never answered this. First of all, Paul George has been fantastic this year. Playing off the ball, he's great. In fact, I'm changing my midseason grade for him from a B to an A-. What was fun about the last game on TNT was the play by play guy, a new guy, noting that Paul George had made some really ridiculous lazy turnovers - Jimmy Jackson who was doing the color said it was a problem with 'the Clippers' and as usual never mentioned the turnover issue ini connection with Paul George (just the Clippers as they always do on the local broadcasts) and then the announcer screamed 'ANOTHER TURNOVER BY PAUL GEORGE!!'. In the general way that you're phrasing it, the answer is 'No'. He's not Kawhi. He doesn't command a double team. He's not the offensive player that Norman Powell is for example, although they're in different leagues defensively. Assuming we were under the cap, no. I'd rather do a sign and trade and let someone else pay and get any of about 30 players for less. But we're not. The first and most important thing is - are we keeping Harden? Until we know that for sure, i.e. until Harden is signed, then I'd make a decision. Without Harden, definitely no, I'd go as high as $25m for 2-3 years without Harden With Harden, I'd go close to whatever his marekt value is - I'm guessing it will be about $35-$40m per year for three years. At that point, yes, I'd sign him. I said his market value is around 100m/3 years and got a lot of pushback. You seem to be reaching the same conclusion, maybe a little higher. I also think Harden's value should be higher than PG, but people don't seem to agree on that either. |
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Post by corkscrew on Jan 25, 2024 12:40:06 GMT -8
Generally, there is a problem with evaluating a player’s value on his own rather than as a part of a team. PG’s value would be hugely different on two hypothetical teams, depending on the makeup of the given team. How many times have we seen a player thrive in one situation and struggle after he is traded to a different team, or vice versa, a player who is not doing well with one team and soars after he is traded?
Typically, on a championship team, the whole is greater than the sum of its parts. Assuming this is a championship caliber team— and the jury is out though it’s looking increasingly more like it at this point — but assuming it is, PG has to be evaluated as a part of this whole, and to say his market value is X makes no sense to me if he is presently an integral part of a championship caliber team.
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Post by gilp5 on Jan 25, 2024 12:44:42 GMT -8
Generally, there is a problem with evaluating a player’s value on his own rather than as a part of a team. PG’s value would be hugely different on two hypothetical teams, depending on the makeup of the given team. How many times have we seen a player thrive in one situation and struggle after he is traded to a different team, or vice versa, a player who is not doing well with one team and soars after he is traded? Typically, on a championship team, the whole is greater than the sum of its parts. Assuming this is a championship caliber team— and the jury is out though it’s looking increasingly more like it at this point — but assuming it is, PG has to be evaluated as a part of this whole, and to say his market value is X makes no sense to me if he is presently an integral part of a championship caliber team. Yes and no. It makes sense depending on how integral he is to the team and whether his value can be replaced by someone making less. Also, as you said, the jury is out on whether this is a championship caliber team. If the team loses in the first or second round of the playoffs, then it is not. If by that time PG is signed to a $50m a year contract, but the rest of the league values him at 30m, then the Clippers are stuck with an albatross contract that they can't trade, on a team with a first or second round ceiling. |
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Post by corkscrew on Jan 25, 2024 13:03:39 GMT -8
Generally, there is a problem with evaluating a player’s value on his own rather than as a part of a team. PG’s value would be hugely different on two hypothetical teams, depending on the makeup of the given team. How many times have we seen a player thrive in one situation and struggle after he is traded to a different team, or vice versa, a player who is not doing well with one team and soars after he is traded? Typically, on a championship team, the whole is greater than the sum of its parts. Assuming this is a championship caliber team— and the jury is out though it’s looking increasingly more like it at this point — but assuming it is, PG has to be evaluated as a part of this whole, and to say his market value is X makes no sense to me if he is presently an integral part of a championship caliber team. Yes and no. It makes sense depending on how integral he is to the team and whether his value can be replaced by someone making less. Also, as you said, the jury is out on whether this is a championship caliber team. If the team loses in the first or second round of the playoffs, then it is not. If by that time PG is signed to a $50m a year contract, but the rest of the league values him at 30m, then the Clippers are stuck with an albatross contract that they can't trade, on a team with a first or second round ceiling. If, if, if. But if we go by the eye test and the performance record, this team has gone 25-7 (.781) since mid-November, best in the league over a 2 1/2 month period, and that's not nothing. And PG HAS been an integral part of that. This team is the closest to a championship team as we have ever had. If a deal to sign him needs to be made now and we break the team up, that would be unforgivably gross malpractice. |
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Post by gilp5 on Jan 25, 2024 13:06:35 GMT -8
Yes and no. It makes sense depending on how integral he is to the team and whether his value can be replaced by someone making less. Also, as you said, the jury is out on whether this is a championship caliber team. If the team loses in the first or second round of the playoffs, then it is not. If by that time PG is signed to a $50m a year contract, but the rest of the league values him at 30m, then the Clippers are stuck with an albatross contract that they can't trade, on a team with a first or second round ceiling. If, if, if. But if we go by the eye test and the performance record, this team has gone 25-7 (.781) since mid-November, best in the league over a 2 1/2 month period, and that's not nothing. And PG HAS been an integral part of that. This team is the closest to a championship team as we have ever had. If a deal to sign him needs to be made now and we break the team up, that would be unforgivably gross malpractice. Of course I would love this to be a championship team. I am not convinced yet, based on the performances against Minnesota and Boston. I am also not convinced this team is closer to a championship team than 2015 or 2020. |
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Post by corkscrew on Jan 25, 2024 13:11:14 GMT -8
If, if, if. But if we go by the eye test and the performance record, this team has gone 25-7 (.781) since mid-November, best in the league over a 2 1/2 month period, and that's not nothing. And PG HAS been an integral part of that. This team is the closest to a championship team as we have ever had. If a deal to sign him needs to be made now and we break the team up, that would be unforgivably gross malpractice. Of course I would love this to be a championship team. I am not convinced yet, based on the performances against Minnesota and Boston. I am also not convinced this team is closer to a championship team than 2015 or 2020. So you would be okay with letting PG go because he is asking too much? Maybe trade him at the deadline, that would be alright with you? |
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Post by gilp5 on Jan 25, 2024 13:26:18 GMT -8
Of course I would love this to be a championship team. I am not convinced yet, based on the performances against Minnesota and Boston. I am also not convinced this team is closer to a championship team than 2015 or 2020. So you would be okay with letting PG go because he is asking too much? Maybe trade him at the deadline, that would be alright with you? I am not against trading PG in concept, but of course it depends on who we get back in return. I would be okay trading PG for SGA, for example. Or for Mitchell. I would also be okay with waiting until the off-season to first see how things go with this team, even if it means the Clippers might have to pay PG a little more than right now if things work out (which is a good problem). |
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