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Post by nuraman00 on Mar 4, 2019 1:15:53 GMT -8
Some fan bases think Beverley is a dirty player. That will drive down his market. Some fans like dirty players.
They would rather have those, than "nice guys" who don't do much.
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Post by trapp76 on Mar 4, 2019 10:04:07 GMT -8
Good for him, still one of my favorite players, and he’s found a nice fit in MIL, much better than PHX. Meanwhile Jared Dudley......... You could make an argument that JJ outperformed Bledsoe during the years he was with the Clippers, especially value wise for the money. Bledsoe actually didn't turn out well for the Suns, but he did for MIL. Personally, as I said at the time, I would have rather kept Bledsoe, but when Doc refused to play Bledsoe at SG, his value would'nt have been maximized here and JJ ended up being a very good player for us. |
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Post by gilp5 on Mar 4, 2019 11:10:47 GMT -8
Meanwhile Jared Dudley......... You could make an argument that JJ outperformed Bledsoe during the years he was with the Clippers, especially value wise for the money. Bledsoe actually didn't turn out well for the Suns, but he did for MIL. Personally, as I said at the time, I would have rather kept Bledsoe, but when Doc refused to play Bledsoe at SG, his value would'nt have been maximized here and JJ ended up being a very good player for us. But Phoenix didn't trade JJ? Bringing up JJ is totally misleading and that's the biggest point of disagreement. JJ was a free agent and Phoenix only facilitated JJ by creating cap room. It was Bledsoe for Dudley and cap room through Butler. So the Clippers approached Phoenix and said "hey we need cap room will you take a max-level player on a rookie contract in exchange for a mediocre journeyman? Oh and we realize you have *4* first round picks this year too but you can keep them." It was criminal. Phoenix was probably opening champagne for weeks. Of course the current FO would never have done this and would've found a better way to sign JJ than that. I think Olshey wouldn't have done this either. Losing Olshey and promoting Doc hurt us tremendously. |
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Post by trapp76 on Mar 4, 2019 12:00:03 GMT -8
You could make an argument that JJ outperformed Bledsoe during the years he was with the Clippers, especially value wise for the money. Bledsoe actually didn't turn out well for the Suns, but he did for MIL. Personally, as I said at the time, I would have rather kept Bledsoe, but when Doc refused to play Bledsoe at SG, his value would'nt have been maximized here and JJ ended up being a very good player for us. But Phoenix didn't trade JJ? Bringing up JJ is totally misleading and that's the biggest point of disagreement. JJ was a free agent and Phoenix only facilitated JJ by creating cap room. It was Bledsoe for Dudley and cap room through Butler. So the Clippers approached Phoenix and said "hey we need cap room will you take a max-level player on a rookie contract in exchange for a mediocre journeyman? Oh and we realize you have *4* first round picks this year too but you can keep them." It was criminal. Phoenix was probably opening champagne for weeks. Of course the current FO would never have done this and would've found a better way to sign JJ than that. I think Olshey wouldn't have done this either. Losing Olshey and promoting Doc hurt us tremendously. No, we don't make that trade if we aren't getting JJ, the trade was primarily for JJ. Agree to disagree I guess, we can go back and forth all day but you're never going to change my mind on that. |
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Post by samiam19 on Mar 4, 2019 12:01:22 GMT -8
can we all just agree it was docs fault
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Post by dyce on Mar 4, 2019 12:52:45 GMT -8
But Phoenix didn't trade JJ? Bringing up JJ is totally misleading and that's the biggest point of disagreement. JJ was a free agent and Phoenix only facilitated JJ by creating cap room. It was Bledsoe for Dudley and cap room through Butler. So the Clippers approached Phoenix and said "hey we need cap room will you take a max-level player on a rookie contract in exchange for a mediocre journeyman? Oh and we realize you have *4* first round picks this year too but you can keep them." It was criminal. Phoenix was probably opening champagne for weeks. Of course the current FO would never have done this and would've found a better way to sign JJ than that. I think Olshey wouldn't have done this either. Losing Olshey and promoting Doc hurt us tremendously. No, we don't make that trade if we aren't getting JJ, the trade was primarily for JJ. Agree to disagree I guess, we can go back and forth all day but you're never going to change my mind on that. Yeah, getting JJ without using the MLE was key. We then split the MLE to get Darren Collison and Matt Barnes. I think that trio more than made up for the loss of Bledsoe for that one year. There was also the issue of Bledsoe about to get paid. JJ on the other hand was on a nice team friendly contract. |
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Post by clipps on Mar 4, 2019 13:21:25 GMT -8
Our outside shooting would have been downright awful with Bledsoe as our 2 instead of JJ.
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Post by gilp5 on Mar 4, 2019 13:43:25 GMT -8
But Phoenix didn't trade JJ? Bringing up JJ is totally misleading and that's the biggest point of disagreement. JJ was a free agent and Phoenix only facilitated JJ by creating cap room. It was Bledsoe for Dudley and cap room through Butler. So the Clippers approached Phoenix and said "hey we need cap room will you take a max-level player on a rookie contract in exchange for a mediocre journeyman? Oh and we realize you have *4* first round picks this year too but you can keep them." It was criminal. Phoenix was probably opening champagne for weeks. Of course the current FO would never have done this and would've found a better way to sign JJ than that. I think Olshey wouldn't have done this either. Losing Olshey and promoting Doc hurt us tremendously. No, we don't make that trade if we aren't getting JJ, the trade was primarily for JJ. Agree to disagree I guess, we can go back and forth all day but you're never going to change my mind on that. Obviously you want to sidestep the real issue. They could've gotten JJ and traded Bledsoe for MUCH more value than what was received. 2 first round picks at a minimum should have came back from Phoenix or another team. This was a massive debacle and arguably one of the main reasons we never made it past the second round (we made it to the second round with Bledsoe too). |
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Post by mistwell on Mar 4, 2019 15:25:06 GMT -8
The Bledsoe trade was awful. It's not that we shouldn't have traded Bledsoe for the space to get JJ, it's that we should have traded him FOR SO MUCH MORE THAN WE GOT. For years now it's as if some people (Trapp76 mostly) just don't see those words I just capitalized. Like it's a fnord to him. Watch, if he responds at all (and he's already declared his mind is closed on the issue and nobody can ever change his mind on it) he will not respond to that aspect, and again pretend "it got us JJ so it was good". |
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Post by dyce on Mar 4, 2019 15:27:46 GMT -8
If I remember correctly Trapp wanted to keep Bledsoe and play him at SG.
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Post by clipps on Mar 4, 2019 15:30:57 GMT -8
Too bad we didn’t have Jerry West towards the beginning of Lob City. We’d probably have a ring or 2 by now.
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Post by gilp5 on Mar 4, 2019 15:44:59 GMT -8
The Bledsoe trade was awful. It's not that we shouldn't have traded Bledsoe for the space to get JJ, it's that we should have traded him FOR SO MUCH MORE THAN WE GOT. For years now it's as if some people (Trapp76 mostly) just don't see those words I just capitalized. Like it's a fnord to him. Watch, if he responds at all (and he's already declared his mind is closed on the issue and nobody can ever change his mind on it) he will not respond to that aspect, and again pretend "it got us JJ so it was good". Exactly Mistwell. |
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Post by mistwell on Mar 4, 2019 16:51:51 GMT -8
If I remember correctly Trapp wanted to keep Bledsoe and play him at SG. His position was that because the coach would not play Bledsoe as starting SG, we had to trade him. And also that he won't talk about if we should have gotten more for him than what we got, and just wants you to think it was a simple matter of Bledsoe for JJ rather than the fact we could have and should have gotten way more for Bledsoe. |
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Post by dyce on Mar 4, 2019 17:52:34 GMT -8
Too bad we didn’t have Jerry West towards the beginning of Lob City. We’d probably have a ring or 2 by now. Would have traded Blake sooner. |
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Post by clipps on Mar 5, 2019 0:38:22 GMT -8
Too bad we didn’t have Jerry West towards the beginning of Lob City. We’d probably have a ring or 2 by now. Would have traded Blake sooner. And Chris Paul would not hold the Clippers by the testicles. |
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