|
|
Post by trapp76 on Mar 6, 2019 11:26:38 GMT -8
If I remember correctly Trapp wanted to keep Bledsoe and play him at SG. You remember correctly. |
|
|
|
Post by trapp76 on Mar 6, 2019 11:28:39 GMT -8
If I remember correctly Trapp wanted to keep Bledsoe and play him at SG. His position was that because the coach would not play Bledsoe as starting SG, we had to trade him. And also that he won't talk about if we should have gotten more for him than what we got, and just wants you to think it was a simple matter of Bledsoe for JJ rather than the fact we could have and should have gotten way more for Bledsoe. I would have rather kept Bledsoe, but I was happy getting JJ for him. JJ was a good player for us and Bledsoe wasn't very good for the Suns. Also like Dyce said, that trade allowed us to get Barnes and Collison as well, instead of having to use the MLE on JJ. I actually like what we got for Bledsoe more than what the Suns got for him when they traded him to MIL. |
|
|
|
Post by trapp76 on Mar 6, 2019 11:29:42 GMT -8
No, we don't make that trade if we aren't getting JJ, the trade was primarily for JJ. Agree to disagree I guess, we can go back and forth all day but you're never going to change my mind on that. Yeah, getting JJ without using the MLE was key. We then split the MLE to get Darren Collison and Matt Barnes. I think that trio more than made up for the loss of Bledsoe for that one year. There was also the issue of Bledsoe about to get paid. JJ on the other hand was on a nice team friendly contract. Exactly right. |
|
|
|
Post by mistwell on Mar 6, 2019 14:08:14 GMT -8
His position was that because the coach would not play Bledsoe as starting SG, we had to trade him. And also that he won't talk about if we should have gotten more for him than what we got, and just wants you to think it was a simple matter of Bledsoe for JJ rather than the fact we could have and should have gotten way more for Bledsoe. I would have rather kept Bledsoe, but I was happy getting JJ for him. JJ was a good player for us and Bledsoe wasn't very good for the Suns. Also like Dyce said, that trade allowed us to get Barnes and Collison as well, instead of having to use the MLE on JJ. I actually like what we got for Bledsoe more than what the Suns got for him when they traded him to MIL. Thank you for proving my point. I even capitalized it, and you didn't reply to that part. And then I referred to it directly in the part you just quoted, and you didn't reply to it. I appreciate you validating my comment. It is, indeed, a fnord for you. You literally cannot see the words WE SHOULD HAVE GOTTEN MORE FOR BLEDSOE. I guess you just see a blank space there? |
|
|
|
Post by gilp5 on Mar 6, 2019 14:43:30 GMT -8
I would have rather kept Bledsoe, but I was happy getting JJ for him. JJ was a good player for us and Bledsoe wasn't very good for the Suns. Also like Dyce said, that trade allowed us to get Barnes and Collison as well, instead of having to use the MLE on JJ. I actually like what we got for Bledsoe more than what the Suns got for him when they traded him to MIL. Thank you for proving my point. I even capitalized it, and you didn't reply to that part. And then I referred to it directly in the part you just quoted, and you didn't reply to it. I appreciate you validating my comment. It is, indeed, a fnord for you. You literally cannot see the words WE SHOULD HAVE GOTTEN MORE FOR BLEDSOE. I guess you just see a blank space there? Mistwell - he is like a politician who will only stick to the talking points and never address an issue that is uncomfortable. It's pretty funny really. Maybe he really believes that we got the best value possible and couldn't have found another team to facilitate space for JJ and still give us more than Dudley. But then he would look dumb for believing that. |
|
|
|
Post by mistwell on Mar 6, 2019 16:28:49 GMT -8
Thank you for proving my point. I even capitalized it, and you didn't reply to that part. And then I referred to it directly in the part you just quoted, and you didn't reply to it. I appreciate you validating my comment. It is, indeed, a fnord for you. You literally cannot see the words WE SHOULD HAVE GOTTEN MORE FOR BLEDSOE. I guess you just see a blank space there? Mistwell - he is like a politician who will only stick to the talking points and never address an issue that is uncomfortable. It's pretty funny really. Maybe he really believes that we got the best value possible and couldn't have found another team to facilitate space for JJ and still give us more than Dudley. But then he would look dumb for believing that. He's going to just repeat that he likes what we got for Bledsoe and pretend liking what we got is the same as addressing that we should have gotten more. It's like spending $1000 for an ice cream cone and saying, "I like the ice cream" without mentioning that you should have gotten more than just an ice cream cone for $1000. |
|
|
|
Post by clipps on Mar 6, 2019 16:44:12 GMT -8
To be honest, Bledsoe didn’t become this stud that we expected out of him before we traded him. Yes, we could have gotten more for him, but we didn’t. Dudley was terrible, but JJ fit our offense a lot better.
|
|
|
|
Post by dyce on Mar 6, 2019 17:36:22 GMT -8
I don't think anyone was thrilled with the trade at the time. Doc never really knew what he had in Bledsoe. Y'all arguing over a trade everyone agrees was not the best use of an asset.
|
|
|
|
Post by mistwell on Mar 6, 2019 18:47:34 GMT -8
I don't think anyone was thrilled with the trade at the time. Doc never really knew what he had in Bledsoe. Y'all arguing over a trade everyone agrees was not the best use of an asset. Trapp absolutely was thrilled with the trade at the time given he felt Doc would never play him at SG as a starter. He did think it was a great use of the asset at the time. It's why he's still defending that position in this very thread, years later. |
|
|
|
Post by gilp5 on Mar 6, 2019 21:30:43 GMT -8
I don't think anyone was thrilled with the trade at the time. Doc never really knew what he had in Bledsoe. Y'all arguing over a trade everyone agrees was not the best use of an asset. By "everyone" you mean people without a chip on their shoulder who are willing to admit they were wrong. |
|
|
|
Post by trapp76 on Mar 7, 2019 11:30:36 GMT -8
I don't think anyone was thrilled with the trade at the time. Doc never really knew what he had in Bledsoe. Y'all arguing over a trade everyone agrees was not the best use of an asset. Trapp absolutely was thrilled with the trade at the time given he felt Doc would never play him at SG as a starter. He did think it was a great use of the asset at the time. It's why he's still defending that position in this very thread, years later. I wasn't thrilled, I wanted to keep Bledsoe. |
|
|
|
Post by trapp76 on Mar 7, 2019 11:32:14 GMT -8
Mistwell - he is like a politician who will only stick to the talking points and never address an issue that is uncomfortable. It's pretty funny really. Maybe he really believes that we got the best value possible and couldn't have found another team to facilitate space for JJ and still give us more than Dudley. But then he would look dumb for believing that. He's going to just repeat that he likes what we got for Bledsoe and pretend liking what we got is the same as addressing that we should have gotten more. It's like spending $1000 for an ice cream cone and saying, "I like the ice cream" without mentioning that you should have gotten more than just an ice cream cone for $1000. The "we could have gotten more" argument is stupid. How the fuck do you know we could've gotten more? You have no fucking clue. You don't know what anybody was offering. What I do know is we ended up getting more back for him than Phoenix did when they traded him a few years later, so I'm not sure how that equates to "we could have gotten more". |
|
|
|
Post by mistwell on Mar 8, 2019 15:19:22 GMT -8
He's going to just repeat that he likes what we got for Bledsoe and pretend liking what we got is the same as addressing that we should have gotten more. It's like spending $1000 for an ice cream cone and saying, "I like the ice cream" without mentioning that you should have gotten more than just an ice cream cone for $1000. The "we could have gotten more" argument is stupid. How the fuck do you know we could've gotten more? You have no fucking clue. You don't know what anybody was offering. What I do know is we ended up getting more back for him than Phoenix did when they traded him a few years later, so I'm not sure how that equates to "we could have gotten more". . |
|
|
|
Post by trapp76 on Mar 12, 2019 12:05:36 GMT -8
The "we could have gotten more" argument is stupid. How the fuck do you know we could've gotten more? You have no fucking clue. You don't know what anybody was offering. What I do know is we ended up getting more back for him than Phoenix did when they traded him a few years later, so I'm not sure how that equates to "we could have gotten more". . Wrong because a guy on a blog posted something? (and btw the headline specifically states it was a "good deal for the Clippers", something that you strongly disagree with). |
|
|
|
Post by mistwell on Mar 12, 2019 13:14:15 GMT -8
Wrong because a guy on a blog posted something? (and btw the headline specifically states it was a "good deal for the Clippers", something that you strongly disagree with). Wrong because he details why and how specifically we could have gotten more for Bledsoe. It's not really in question. We can see, in retrospect, what could have been done and was not done based on what happened during and after the trade. As he details: But that viewpoint breaks down when you realize that seven weeks later the Suns flipped Butler for two cheap contracts, Ish Smith and Viacheslav Kravtsov. The trade partner this time? Milwaukee, coincidentally enough. So at the end of the day when you combine the two deals, the Suns got Eric Bledsoe, Ish Smith and Viacheslav Kravtsov for Jared Dudley and a second round pick. Holy FSM! They added a potential all star in Bledsoe, and didn't even take on signficant additional salary to do so after flipping Butler. Bledsoe, Smith and Kravtsov combined make a little more than $5M while Dudley makes $4.25M. (Of course that salary equation is going to change after this summer when Bledsoe gets his payday, something we have to continually remind ourselves in evaluating the long term impact of this deal.) Nor was the structure of the deal an impediment to the Clippers doing better. The fact that Phoenix wound up dealing Butler to the Bucks illustrates very clearly that the Clippers could have gotten Redick (the real prize of the summer obviously) without parting with Bledsoe. They could have done Butler and a 2nd rounder for Redick and Smith and Kravtsov; they could have included a second pick, either of their own or one they bought off another team, and given Milwaukee the exact same return. (Obviously the Bucks thought that the Suns second rounder was going to be in the 30s despite the fact that now it looks like it will be in the 50s, so it probably would have needed to be a decent second rounder, but there are ways.) Looked at this way, the Clippers essentially got Dudley and a second round pick in exchange for Bledsoe -- and obviously that's not good value. |
|
